IndieView with Joe Johnston, author of Grits to Glory

So, while there are a lot of technical aspects to the history, it’s really a story of memories, why mom and dad cooked these foods this way, which is because their parents did. In the South, every dish has a story, and we can’t talk about our food without talking about our people.

Joe Johnston – 15 July 2019

The Back Flap

Travel through a folksy history of Southern cooking from the best fruitcake recipe before the Civil War to the ultimate Southern kitchen essential, the cast iron pan. Joe Johnston’s cultural history brings reminiscences from his own friends and family but is not at all lacking in thoroughly-researched historical anecdotes. It is sprinkled with valuable stories and quotes from Southerners who really know their stuff! This book is for those from every Southern walk of life, but is also particularly appealing to those simply fascinated with cooking, history, and anything in between! With every detailed recollection, the heart and soul of Southern cooking shines through.

About the book

What is the book about?

Grits to Glory tells the history of Southern Cooking. Why do people in the South eat the things they do, prepared the way they prepare them, and how come the folks “up there” don’t eat all this good food?

The most important thesis of Grits to Glory is that Southern Cookin’ is a blend of three influences. It’s the product of American affluence before the Civil War, but would never have happened the way it did without the resourcefulness of poor white people. But it was former slaves who knew how to make a lot from a little. And American Indians contributed knowledge of foods, preservation, and cooking that still persist today. As the book says, if you like to eat, thank an Indian.

There are no recipes in the book, but lots of detailed ingredients and preparation. There are tidbits of ancient history, like the fact that almost everything modern Americans eat is the same nine foods that people were eating thousands of years ago. It includes the migrations of food across continents, and how tastes and cultures determined what stands the test of time in various places. So, while there are a lot of technical aspects to the history, it’s really a story of memories, why mom and dad cooked these foods this way, which is because their parents did. In the South, every dish has a story, and we can’t talk about our food without talking about our people.

When did you start writing the book?

It didn’t start as a book. It started as a historical interest that amazed and amused me. As I learned about the history of Southern food, I realized that nobody had written about it in this way. The process of visualizing the book went on for a few years, but the actual writing began fall of 2016.

How long did it take you to write it?

It took a year. All my books seem to take about a year to write.

Where did you get the idea from?

I get this question a lot, coupled with people saying they’ve often wondered why we eat grits, or who ate the first oyster, etc.

It began when I was a kid in Oklahoma, a state with a unique blend of cultures and culinary traditions. My family always raised gardens and canned everything from green beans to pickled eggs. I met the real Col. Sanders when he was driving around the country selling his Kentucky Fried Chicken recipe to restaurants, one at a time. I ate Indian frybread and tacos. We ate pigs feet and every meal had an abundance of fruits and vegetables. My family was three generations removed from living in the deep South, but we ate a basically Southern diet.

Another contributing factor to my curiosity was living in Ohio for a few years. There I ate bagels, lox, and blintzes for the first time. Then living in Tennessee introduced me to more pure old-time ways of gardening, preserving, and cooking.

Finally, after writing several books and articles about history, mostly the Civil War, I began to understand how these various threads were woven together to create what is Southern Cookin’ today. It has happened only one time in exactly this way, anywhere on earth, and it happened because of the Civil War. That’s the story that had never been told.

Were there any parts of the book where you struggled?

The hardest part was condensing the story. It’s so deep and long, it could have gone on forever. And I didn’t want to create a tedious, scholarly text. I really wanted it to be a fun read, with all the heart and warmth that surrounds family cooking.

Aside from that, the early history of American food isn’t very well preserved. Until the 20th Century, a lot of people couldn’t read and write, so there weren’t many books. Cookbooks were very rare until well after the Civil War. Cooking was an oral tradition. Certainly among American Indians and African American slaves and their descendants, the written record begins even later. As a result, it took a lot of work to piece together that history from the the first colonies to the Civil War. It’s cultural history that nobody had written in just this way before, so I had to piece it together from bits in books, journals, paintings, and so forth.

What came easily?

The research was fun! I got to eat a lot of everything I loved, and it went on for years before I even knew I was doing it!

As the books says, in the South, we can’t talk about our food without talking about our people. Every dish has a story. So everybody I talked to had memories, methods, and traditions to talk about. They had dishes that the same dishes had been served in for generations. That part of the research was like turning on a faucet. I just had to ask.

Are your characters entirely fictitious or have you borrowed from real world people you know?

Everybody in the book is real, people I’ve known or have heard about. Everybody has a story. Everybody is a story.

We all know how important it is for writers to read. Are there any particular authors that have influenced how you write and, if so, how have they influenced you?

This is a dense topic. So many writers. Maybe more than anyone, Hemingway. He writes in simple words and short sentences. He leaves a lot of spaces for readers to fill in with their imagination.

No writer lives in the South without getting a big dose of William Faulkner. He sees the beauty, drama, and backstory in the mundane. But personally, I prefer Rick Bragg’s storytelling.

Also, Thomas Wolfe. Although he goes into overwhelming detail about side stories, he taught me to see that those side stories are there. He aroused my curiosity about why people and things are the way they are.

In the contemporary world, John Grisham is a fine teller of complex stories. So is Ken Follet. Elmore Leonard writes the way his characters talk.

You can tell I talk a lot about storytelling. As a southern author, I think that’s my job, telling stories. I grew up going to southern churches, and we learned from those preachers that everything and anything can be the subject of a good story.

Do you have a target reader?

I have a target reader for every book. In today’s world, we can’t write without giving some thought to marketing. We have to think about who we’re going to market the book to if we want to make any money at this career.

I’ve written books and articles about the Wild West, and that reader overlaps with the audience for Grits to Glory, but it’s not the same audience in total. Same with my Civil War articles, etc. So yes, I write with certain people in mind. That’s the most important thing. A mentor once told me not to write so people can understand, but to write so people can’t help but understand.

About Writing

Do you have a writing process? If so can you please describe it?

I write at least 1,000 words every day. Personally, I’m most creative in the early morning. I do more routine tasks like editing in the afternoon.

I write every day, but for me as a writer, there’s no wasted time. Every place I go, everyone I meet, could be research, even if I don’t know it at the time.

I refer to research a lot. Most of my career has been nonfiction, including a lot of journalism. I can’t sit in my room and make this stuff up. I have to go out and dig and find books and plow through the internet and talk to people. I watch movies and go to baseball games. I hang out at the auto parts store and the farmers market. That’s all part of the process of writing.

Do you outline? If so, do you do so extensively or just chapter headings and a couple of sentences?

I make minimal outlines, but revise them, ending up with a series of outlines as a book progresses. I outline sections within the book. For me, the outline is all about finding the best way to tell the story. Where does it start? How can I tell this story so people will understand? How much do I leave unsaid, to unveil later? Those are big questions that lead to a vague first outline.

Do you edit as you go or wait until you’ve finished?

I just start writing and let it flow, as if I’m telling the story out loud. Editing can come later. So, I end up with two approaches to editing. I edit the big picture: Does this tell the story clearly and dramatically? And I edit the minutiae. Is this sentence better inverted? Do I really want all these commas?!

And while I’m on the subject, I resist semi-colons like the plague. One of the hardest things we have to do is decide how to punctuate. A lot of commas are optional. Sentences can start with “and” or “but.” Dashes and ellipses are almost always a choice, rather than dictated by rule. Editors and publishers often have their own standards. So the overriding principal has to be clarity and telling the story in the best way.

Did you hire a professional editor?

I have hired professional editors. Money well spent. But most of my books are published by small indie publishers who also supply an editor.

Do you listen to music while you write? If yes, what gets the fingers tapping?.

Never. I’m a musician, so I start listening to the music, singing along, and it’s very distracting.

About Publishing

Did you submit your work to Agents?

Not Grits to Glory. I’ve sent other books to agents.

Here’s a fun exercise. Pick 25 agents and look at their resumes. You’ll find that agents grew up in major cities in the north and east. They attended at least one elite college, probably a small one. They live in one of about four major U.S. cities.

Most agents aren’t likely to have any idea who I am, why I write the way I do, or who my audience is. How can an agent who grew up in Boston, went to Bryn Mawr College, and lives in Manhattan, understand a book like Grits to Glory?

I’m sure some agents are great. Hope I have one someday.

What made you decide to go Indie, whether self-publishing or with an indie publisher? Was it a particular event or a gradual process?

I’ve self-published and I’ve been with indie publishers. Personally, I really enjoy the teamwork and synergy of being with a publisher. I’ve done a lot of creative projects in advertising, art, music, etc., in big companies and flying solo. Being independent gets old for me. I love being part of a team effort.

Did you get your book cover professionally done or did you do it yourself?

I’m an artist and graphic designer, so I designed them, with a full-time pro doing the finished art.

Do you have a marketing plan for the book or are you just winging it?

It’s essential to have a marketing plan and to constantly update it. In general, I start by hitting the road, speaking and signing as many books in as many places as I can. By the time my tour is over, I’m well into a next book, so I spend more time at home, getting that book into the pipeline, and turn to other marketing tools like social media for the book that just had a tour.

There’s a lot of opportunism, taking advantage of places to plug the book or stores to get it in. But the plan is the foundation.

It you don’t know marketing, read a book about it. Marketing is not about me and my book. It’s about the people out there, what they’re interested in, and why they might enjoy my book.

Any advice that you would like to give to other newbies considering becoming Indie authors?

One. Don’t expect to get rich, but you might. Two, write if you have to write. There’s nothing glamorous about it. Three, write every day without fail. If you have nothing to work on in your current book, write something else. Write what you see out your window. Write a character description. Write something.

And read good books.

About You

Where did you grow up?

Tulsa, OK

Where do you live now?

Tulsa, OK

What would you like readers to know about you?

I’m a storyteller.

What are you working on now?

I’m finishing the manuscript for my most demanding work so far, a recent-history biography that includes a true crime mystery. It’s mostly oral history, told by the subject of the book. But I had to piece it together from many sources, so getting the overlapping elements woven together has required a lot of rewrite. Many times I’ve moved big sections and little sections around to find the most effective way to unroll the story. It’s taken twice as long to write as my other books, and I’m very excited about the result.

I’m also working on my first fiction.

End of Interview:

For more from Joe visit his website, like his Facebook page and the Facebook page for the book.

Get your copy of Grits to Glory from Amazon US or Amazon UK.